78 – Case Study #5 Tina – chronic unrelenting stress, arthritis & more

Posted on 8th October 2024

This episode dives into detail exploring a case study on herbal support following trauma. Learn about potential herbal and nutritional options for Tina:

Tina (she/her) is a single mum whose son has been in prison the last 18 months. Since he’s been inside his self-harm has worsened to the point of repeated suicide attempts. Tina is nervously exhausted from phone calls and prison visits. Her arthritis has flared up so badly that she is now using a walking stick on very bad days. She has body pain all over and isn’t refreshed by sleep. She feels tense and unable to relax on a daily basis because she is so worried about her son. She takes Ibuprofen and Paracetamol regularly but no other medication. She is in early menopause and sleep is affected by night sweats. She has lost her appetite.

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Transcript
Nicole:

Welcome to the Frontline Herbalism podcast with your host, Nicole Rose from the

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solidarity apothecary.

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This is your place for all things plants and

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liberation.

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Let's get started.

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Hello.

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Welcome back to the Frontline Herbalism

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podcast.

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This is the fifth case study that I've put

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together for the herbalism PTSD and traumatic stress course to kind of, yeah, support

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people, get a flavor of what kind of roles herbs can play in supporting people

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experiencing kind of long term chronic stress or, you know, traumatic stress who are kind of

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potentially in the midst of or recovering from trauma.

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So, yeah, I guess, content warning, I do mention a few prison y things like self harm

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and stuff, but, yeah, I hope you find it interesting and shameless.

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Plug the herbalism PTSD and traumatic stress course closes for enrolment on Sunday.

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So, yeah, please get in there now if you'd like to join.

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Like I say all the time, no one is turned away for lack of funds.

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You can find a link to the kind of solidarity pricing info on the course page.

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Yeah, there's also the payment plan options and things.

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So, yeah, feel free to take a look, and I would love to welcome you into the course and,

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yeah, thanks for listening.

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I hope this is of value to people.

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Okay, take care.

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Thanks.

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All right, so, Tina.

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Tina, she.

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Her is a single mum whose son has been in prison the last 18 months.

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Since he's been inside, his self harm has worsened to the point of repeated suicide

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attempts.

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Tina is nervously exhausted from phone calls

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and prison visits.

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Her arthritis has flared up so badly that she

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is now using a walking stick on very bad days.

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She has body pain all over and isn't refreshed

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by sleep.

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She feels tense and unable to relax on a daily

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basis because she is so worried about her son.

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She takes ibuprofen and paracetamol regularly,

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but no other medication.

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She is in early menopause and sleep is

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affected by night sweats.

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She has lost her appetite.

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Okay, so, yeah, kind of working through the same framework that we have with the other

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case studies.

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So looking at medication and allergies, sleep,

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nervous system state, digestion, nutrition and inflammation.

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So in terms of medication, she's taking ibuprofen and paracetamol, which, you know,

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for someone in chronic pain, I can 100% understand why you would take them.

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You know, like I. When I had all my horrific cause chondritis, like chronic inflammation in

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the cartilage of the ribs, like, I did get very dependent on ibuprofen because, yeah, it

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just is, you know, effective a lot of the time.

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However, it had a very harmful effect on my gut health, which kind of lengthened the

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amount of months slash years that I had bad inflammation.

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This was like years before my clinical training.

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But ideally, we would be getting to a place where, where, you know, in terms of herbal

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actions where inflammation has reduced so that she doesn't have to take these medications

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because they are going to be having this kind of potential harmful effect on her gut,

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especially the paracetamol.

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But yeah, for now, obviously, the herbs aren't

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going to be contraindicating with these two kind of common painkillers.

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But I'm just saying as a kind of long term goal, that would be amazing to work towards.

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Right, where she's not in pain, not just for the sake of the painkillers, but just because

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who wants to be in pain, right? Okay, so in terms of sleep.

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So it's mentioned about sleep getting interrupted by night sweats.

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So yeah, some of the herbs mentioned in the herbalism, PTSD and traumatic stress course

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that are kind of particularly indicated here could include linden, like lime tree flower,

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you know, it's fantastic.

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Kind of diaphoretic, which means helps kind of

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induce like perspiration and sweating, but in a sense that it kind of like cools you down.

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And, yeah, it's a very kind of cooling and relaxant herbicide.

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Mother war is, you know, kind of similar action, also very calming and relaxing.

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Obviously, she's got vast amounts of kind of activation going on, so that could be

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effective.

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Yarrow is also cooling and would have this

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kind of multifunctional action because of its support potentially for arthritis, you know.

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Yeah, I'm going to talk about.

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Actually, I'll save it.

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I'll talk about arthritis in the inflammation section.

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But Yarrow is one of the nervines in the course.

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It's kind of more has an affinity with kind of wound care and, you know, the pelvic region,

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things like this.

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But it's also like, fantastic because it's a

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circulatory stimulant, but it's very cooling.

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And as you know, a lot of people experiencing

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kind of traumatic stress and like, nervous system activation are often, you know, have a

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lot of, like, heat signs.

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Right?

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Have a lot of inflammation, have a lot of kind of heat.

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Anger, rage, anxiety.

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And so, yeah, we're wanting our kind of

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cooling herbs.

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And yarrow is brilliant because it stimulates

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the blood, but it's also very cooling and it's also diaphoretic.

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So Yarrow is kind of traditionally integrated into kind of fever blends.

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Like Yarrow, peppermint and elderflower, for example, is like a perfect mix, you know, when

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someone has, like, a cold or the flu.

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Skull cap.

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So I've talked about skull cap so many times, but wonderful kind of nervine tonic nerve and

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nervine tropho restorative, full of b vitamins, really kind of cooling and calming,

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supporting you to move into that kind of parasympathetic state.

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Also helpful in cases of kind of night sweats.

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Yeah, and I'm going to talk more when I talk

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about the inflammation, actually, I'll save it, then I'll talk about schisandra as a kind

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of potential herb that has this indication with people in kind of perimenopause.

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Hops is another option in terms of night sweats and sleep.

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Yeah.

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Nervous system state.

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So bless Tina.

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There is a lot going on.

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Yeah, there is a lot of kind of chronic nervous exhaustion, a lot of tension and

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worry, which are the kind of their own.

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Like, I always think, like, tension is such an

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interesting state for the body in terms of what it does to our muscles and our cartilage.

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And, you know, worry can be a bit, kind of faster, a bit more activation, a bit more kind

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of, kind of unrelenting kind of thinking and lots of fear.

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But attention is more of a kind of, like, free state response of you're just carrying so

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much, you can't breathe out kind of feeling.

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So, yeah, I would definitely be thinking about

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relaxants for Tina.

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So, you know, I've mentioned these a bunch in

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the other case studies and we go into them in depth in the course, but, you know, chamomile,

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fantastic general relaxant for that kind of like daytime support to kind of tone down that

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background anxiety fever view.

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Again, similar.

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I've included it in the general kind of relaxant section of the course.

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I don't think I've talked about it much, but it's part of the Daisy family and it's kind of

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been pigeonholed as this migraine herb.

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It has an affinity with blood flow to the

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head, but also has kind of.

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Is used for things like period pains, too.

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And the reason I thought about it for Tina was because of her arthritis.

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And I haven't put in the description what kind of arthritis she's experiencing, whether

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that's a kind of immune mediated, kind of rheumatoid arthritis, or that's more of a kind

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of like osteoarthritis or, you know, disintegration of cartilage or just kind of

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general joint pain.

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I've tried to keep these really vague because

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I'm aware that not everyone, excuse me, working through the course is going to be like

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a general herbalist.

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Right.

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Or have, you know, an understanding or training about kind of other conditions.

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Like, the course's focus is on trauma.

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But I do, when I talk about the plants and

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introduce them in the plant profiles, I do like to kind of give some of the other common

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kind of medicinal actions that they're kind of used.

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Like, you know, people have worked with them for years around because obviously we can

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separate things.

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Right.

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Like her arthritis is, you know, could well be a kind of trauma response or like a response

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to kind of chronic long term stress.

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And.

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Yeah, I'll talk about that in the arthritis bit soon, but, yeah, fever v could be a good

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option.

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It's.

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Yeah, I could help be kind of cooling with the night sweats and things and help with the

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joint pain potentially.

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It's kind of got very gentle antispasmodic

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action.

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And it's also, yeah, this sort of gentle

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nervine lavender.

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I just want to smother tina in lavender.

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I think it would be really nourishing for her nervous system and strengthening as well as

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relaxing and calming.

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Hawthorn.

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Yeah, hawthorn is obviously a wonderful gentle relaxant.

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Wonderful in cases of kind of chronic inflammation.

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But, you know, also, I talk about it in the course, but Hawthorne has this affinity with

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the cartilage.

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Right.

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Like, I really actually see it as a herb in my kind of sort of musculoskeletal kind of

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toolboxes.

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I. Yeah, I've worked with Hawthorne a really

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long time, like, with my ribcage stuff.

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And, yeah, I think there's, like, so many

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different layers to it of supporting, you know, blood flow and cardiovascular health and

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blood vessel health, which is going to be supporting our tissues to get more blood.

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You know, like, if you have, like, pain in an area with tissues, often, it's because things

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aren't moving necessarily.

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Like oxygen's not getting in and nutrients

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aren't getting in and kind of, you know, like inflammatory cells and things aren't getting

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out.

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So it kind of becomes, like, more and more

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painful.

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And I think Hawthorn can kind of support the

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blood vessels to kind of support with that sort of.

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I hate the word detox because it's, like, really associated with just this, like, real

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bougie, like, let's have a smoothie detox stuff.

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But I just mean in terms of, like, shifting and moving kind of sort of inflammatory matter

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in the body, if that makes sense.

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I'm kind of not doing this justice.

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I'm very sleep deprived.

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Lee has been teething, so it's, yeah, a whole

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new world of fun.

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Well, not for him.

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It's awful for him.

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And it's also not fun for me and Rob either.

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But anyway, yeah, so Hawthorne is going to be potentially supporting with the joints, with

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the cartilage, with, you know, with kind of like, blood vessels, like I've talked about.

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So, yeah, I think.

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And also with this kind of grief and pain and

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heartache.

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Right.

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Like, I can't imagine Lee having harm, you know, or.

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I know he's only, like, tiny, but the thought of him being in prison just, like, would

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completely break me.

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And I think, yeah, for her, like, it must be

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horrific to have a son in prison, you know, and have that kind of daily feeling of, like,

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what's going on for him, you know? So, yeah, definitely Hawthorn for grief.

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And Rose, just because it's a babe, you know, like, wonderful for grief and emotional

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stress.

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General relaxant, very cooling and, yeah, just

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really kind of comforting and nourishing and, you know, maybe.

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Maybe like, it sounds like Tina is kind of holding a lot in her body, right?

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Like, you know, she's expressing her distress through her body, through her pain.

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I don't know anything about her personality, obviously, she's completely hypothetical, but,

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you know, it might be that Rose could help release some stuff.

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Right.

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You know, like, with all my ribcage stuff, I

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was terrible at crying.

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Like, I've always been not very good at

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crying.

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And, yeah, that's a long term trauma response

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thing.

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But I think for Tina, like, maybe she's a kind

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of stoic, hyper responsible mom type.

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Right.

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And maybe she needs that rose to actually help release some of those feelings and that

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distress and that might help with her kind of tension and body pain.

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So, yeah, I definitely want to be nourishing her with lots of tonics, lots of nervous

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system tonics.

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So, yeah, just, you know, I think when someone

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is so depleted, you can kind of give them anything and it will help, but, you know,

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betany is an option for that kind of really long term stress.

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Arthritis can often have a kind of liver link in terms of kind of.

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Yeah, metabolism and stuff in the body.

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So betany has this affinity with the liver, so

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might be supportive.

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Also has this kind of musculoskeletal affinity

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as well.

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Evening primrose.

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I haven't talked about evening primrose much, but there's a whole plant profile about

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evening primrose in the course.

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And, yeah, like, it's not just kind of these

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amazing little capsules you can get with the oil, which I think would be wonderful for her,

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especially with her kind of night sweats and kind of, you know, I don't want to, like,

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pathologize the menopause because it's not.

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It isn't a disease.

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Like, it is a completely normal, like, bodily process.

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Does that make sense? But I also want to name and acknowledge that

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people can feel discomfort and distress and kind of harm when, you know, certain things

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are kind of out of balance, when it's, you know, things are really kind of affecting

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them.

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So, yeah, I'm not saying that, like, we should

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pathologize menopause and that it needs, like, quote unquote treatment.

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I'm just saying that, you know, there can be support for symptoms that we're experiencing

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that are kind of affecting us in ways that we don't kind of want, if that makes sense.

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So, yeah, so evening primrose, all those kind of essential fatty acids are going to be

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really great for her arthritis.

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But also, I would, you know, evening primrose

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as a tincture is really wonderful in general, as a nervine, in my opinion.

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Yeah, I would really be thinking about kind of HPA access stuff, and I talk about what that

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means in the nervous system.

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Deep dive in the course.

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But the hypothalamic, pituitary, adrenal axis, right?

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Like, the way that our kind of brain communicates with our adrenal glands and our

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hormones to kind of respond to stress and stuff in the body, like, you know, and that

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kind of process is being depleted, like, a lot over a long term.

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And I think in the case study about Ahmed that I introduced, I talked about how he is, you

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know, he was the refugee from Afghanistan.

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So it's like he had this, like, horrific kind

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of year of really brutal trauma and stress, but before that was, like, very kind of

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physically active and healthy.

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And it's like a teenager without kind of

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chronic health issues.

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Whereas Tina.

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This is the.

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Tina's, like, the sort of person that I'm more

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worried about in terms of chronic issues and chronic fatigue and chronic inflammation,

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because you're looking at, like, what, 50, 60 years, potentially, of chronic stress, like,

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depending on her background, obviously.

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You know, maybe.

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Maybe it's not, and maybe it's just been the last 18 months, but even 18 months is a long

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time of chronic stress and, like, loading on the body.

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So, yeah, I'm going to be thinking about what's going on in her body in terms of that,

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like, kind of unrelenting stress response.

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All those stress hormones and, yeah, there's

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lots of kind of research around the HPA axis and sort of perimenopausal symptoms and that,

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you know, that kind of, like, adrenal stuff coming up at that kind of time in someone's

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life.

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So, yeah, so licorice might be.

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Might be a good option.

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Licorice is also kind of moistening and

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mucligenus.

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So, you know, if she's got kind of dry, hot,

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painful joints, then licorice is, like, potentially very, like, nourishing here.

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Milky oats, you know, just for that kind of chronic exhaustion would be.

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Yeah, wonderful.

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Schisandra is kind of one of our, like, nerve

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tonics, which is more kind of also indicated in this kind of adaptogen category, which I

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don't.

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I don't use the framework of adaptogens in

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the.

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In the course.

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I'd prefer to focus on sort of nerve tonics simply because people think, oh, I need a herb

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to help me adapt to stress, and then they end up taking these, like, really stimulating,

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like, hardcore herbs that lead to, like, really hardcore burnout.

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And I'm going to do a podcast about that at some point.

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But Schisandra, I think, is a fantastic nerve tonic.

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And again, this kind of indication with the HPA axis, you know, it lowers kind of elevated

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cortisol.

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So I would.

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Yeah, I would be thinking that she also needs a bit of support.

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Right.

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Like, this stress isn't.

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Isn't a stopping anytime soon.

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It's not like she's recovering from something

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that happened a while back.

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Like she's really in the kind of, you know, in

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the kind of eye of the storm, so to speak.

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So, yeah, I think when someone is in that

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place of daily stress that is unlikely to reduce anytime soon, I think that's when herbs

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like Schisandra really come into their own, because it's kind of like a harm reduction

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approach.

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Yeah.

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Another potential nerve tonic is St. John's wort, you know, really fantastic for sort of

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like, nerve pain, also for things like arthritis.

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You know, it could be like a really nice option, could be a really lovely, like, muscle

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rub, you know, that she could have for her arthritis and for her tension.

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And, yes, St. John's war would be great.

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And also just for kind of that tonic action

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and lifting mood.

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Vervain.

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I would 100% have a go to a vervain with Tina.

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I think vervain is, for me, I just associate

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it with, like, burnt out femme, you know, like someone because of patriarchy who's socialized

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to do all the caring like, looking after everyone under the sun to the absolute neglect

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of the self without resources, without the financial resources, like taking on the

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emotional labor of everything and everyone.

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Like, I think vervain is, like, really

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fantastic for that kind of chronic exhaustion and depletion.

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And I think Tina's probably, like, really playing that role in her life.

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And, you know, when we look at these case studies as, like, always thinking about other,

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other responses beyond just like, herbs and nutrition.

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Right.

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You know, like, what collective care does she

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need? Like, you know, it'd be amazing if she had a

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little WhatsApp group of friends that could support her with her son or, you know, she

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could be part of a prisoner solidarity group to, again, access support and generate, you

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know, action alerts for her son or something so she's not, like, completely alone.

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Maybe, you know, she might get some financial support so that she could visit him or, you

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know, maybe people could crowdfund to get her kind of professional counseling or therapy,

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for example, to kind of.

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Yeah, or, you know, do like, co counseling or

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something.

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Yeah, I think just things, you know, it's

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important to not just grin and grin and bear it, you know, grin, grin and bear.

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It's important not to grin and bear it, you know, but to also access support.

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And I can imagine for this kind of.

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Yeah.

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Suffering mother archetype, it could be that she's been giving out a really long time and.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Withania.

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So Ashwagandha, you know, I'm always nervous

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with ashwagandha in terms of anxiety and things, but I think for Tina, she is more in

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that state of depletion, you know? And I think, yeah, I think it could

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potentially be supportive as part of a blend because of its affinity with the HPA axis.

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It's also supportive for rheumatoid arthritis, you know, can help with sleep and just kind of

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this, like, sort of chronic exhaustion.

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But yeah, I'm sure there's many other nerve

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ions and nerve tonics that could be supportive in terms of her digestion.

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She's mentioned loss of appetite.

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So we might be thinking about, like, well, one

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aspect of that is like bitter herbs, right? Like, bitter herbs is kind of taste that

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communicates to the body that they need to release certain enzymes and stuff to help

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digest our nutrients.

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Not just our nutrients, but digest our food

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properly.

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You know, kind of herbs that could be good in

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that respect include sort of chamomile fever views, also a bitter and has this kind of

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liver support.

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Motherwort is bitter and also has liver

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support.

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Yarrow.

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I've mentioned skullcap, Bettany and vervain.

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So again, we're like, stacking functions.

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Right.

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Again, lack of.

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I mean, loss of appetite can also be because of, like, a million and one other things.

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You know, sometimes it's from kind of chronic dysbiosis, like that kind of imbalance of kind

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of gut flora.

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You know, it could be causing a lot of nausea,

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for example.

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And, yeah, you might.

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Again, if I had, like, loads of money to pay for clients to get their, like, gut

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microbiomes tested and mapped, we might be able to see what's going on there, because gut

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health is really, really strongly linked to things like arthritis and, you know, body

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pain, fibromyalgia, things like that.

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So, yeah, I think I. If I was supporting Tina,

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I would be thinking about giving her those nerve iron tonics as a priority and nervine

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relaxants that will help her get through this time.

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But in terms of actually addressing the chronic pain and inflammation and the

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arthritis, I'd be really trying to screen for things like food intolerances.

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I'd be looking at improving her gut health, things that will help modulate inflammation.

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For example, chamomile feverview.

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I've already mentioned in terms of its support

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for things like nerve pain and arthritis.

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Lavender oil would be really fantastic

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topically.

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I've mentioned about Hawthorne already in

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terms of cartilage, again, like, nourishment, like rose hips would be really fantastic.

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Yeah.

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We might also be thinking about our sort of

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anti spasmodics that can help with actual kind of pain and tension.

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So things like hops is antispasmodic, mugwort.

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Yeah, maybe even wild lettuce, it would be

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kind of strong.

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But I. If she was having, like, a real bad

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pain day, it could be really fantastic.

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And also maybe help her sleep longer and

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deeper, which is, you know, sleep is the main thing that's going to be helping with

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addressing any sort of chronic inflammation, which is why it's always at the top of my

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list.

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You know, I've mentioned betany as a nervine,

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but, yeah, has this wonderful affinity with the liver and it's also kind of diuretic.

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So, yeah, where there's sort of dampness, like, I haven't specified what sort of

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arthritis she's got, but if it was that kind of dampness, stagnant kind of tissue state, we

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would be thinking of our more sort of drying herbs.

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So, yeah, and I talk about tissue states in the course.

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I've talked about licorice for inflammation, milky oats, again, fantastic for connective

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tissue mentioned cassandra already in St.

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John's wort.

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So, yeah, like, there's a lot there.

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Right.

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Like, again, I would be thinking daytime blend, which is helping with her kind of

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generally relax this tension and giving sort of nervous system support at the same time

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giving inflammation support and digestive support.

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So, you know, several of these have come up a few times, you know, like chamomile and fever

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view and things.

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And I would definitely want to give her, like,

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quite, you know, a big kind of tonic mix and maybe.

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Yeah, maybe for the nights, like some skullcap tea, just, you know, just to help get through

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the night and, you know, support with that kind of tropho restorative, kind of long term,

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like, recovery option and then.

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Yeah, really kind of focusing down on sort of

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gut health.

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Yeah, other, you know, I know, like, Sage has

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this kind of affinity with kind of night sweats in this, like, menopausal stage.

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It's generally like short term use only.

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And, you know, I do profile sage in the kind

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of warming, sort of stimulating nervine section of the herbalism PTSD and traumatic

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stress course.

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And, yeah, like I mentioned it for Ahmed, but

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just, you know, a ****** bath every evening with epsom salts and essential oils in there.

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You know, maybe lavender and chamomile essential oil and some rose petals.

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You know, it would just be so fantastic to have, you know, kind of optimum nutrients

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coming in through the skin, like transdermally or, you know, a magnesium spray if she doesn't

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have time for baths.

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You know, maybe there could be, like, a

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specific kind of blend for, you know, for phone calls.

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You know, after she's had a distressing phone call from her son, she can take a sip of rose

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petal glycerite.

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Like, I've done that for absolutely years as

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part of my sort of, like, energetic work.

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And, you know, because, like, one.

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You know, Sam and Kev have pretty much called me every day for years.

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And it used to be Taylor.

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And I've had other friends in prison, you

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know, that have called me regularly.

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So it's like.

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It is awful listening to someone listening to what's going on on the wing, like all these

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kind of ligature attempts and horrors and self harming and, you know, screws being screws and

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attacking people and stuff.

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It's like.

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It is awful.

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Like, obviously it's awful being in prison,

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experiencing it, but it's also awful hearing about it vicariously.

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And, you know, I'd also maybe think about supporting Tina with, like, a specific prison

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visit blend, right? And I recorded an episode about herbal support

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for prison visits.

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So, yeah, kind of thinking about, you know,

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something like, very specifically that can help her on those days.

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Oh, I haven't mentioned elderberry.

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Elderberry would be wonderful for Tina.

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Super nutritive, like, wonderful musculoskeletal relaxant.

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Helpful female tension in the body.

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Yeah, I would be, yeah, thinking of, like,

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something very nourishing she can take and immune supporting.

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I would want to clarify what sort of arthritis she has before giving her things like

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echinacea and stuff, in case there's, like, an autoimmunity aspect.

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But, yeah, that's what I would be thinking.

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And also, you know, like, if you could

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organize it collectively, like, getting her a ****** massage, you know, getting her some

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body work to help with this kind of, like, systemic detoxification, and, you know,

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supporting with this tension, that would just be.

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Oh, my God, now I want to start a massage.

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A fund for prisoner families.

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But, yeah, okay.

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I think.

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I think that's the things I wanted to say.

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So if any of this takes your fancy, this is

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the sort of last case study.

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I'll try and create some more for the sort of

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next time I promote the course.

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But if you haven't heard, it is closing for

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enrollment on Sunday.

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So, yeah, last chance to join.

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Yeah.

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Please check out the course page.

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Feel free to dm me on instagram with any questions.

Nicole:

I'm sorry, I'm a bit slow getting back to you on email.

Nicole:

Because of the bubber, it's much harder to get on the laptop.

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But, yeah, I do go on my phone when he's napping.

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So that's the kind of.

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Yeah, fastest way to get a response.

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Okay, thanks so much for listening.

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I hope this has been helpful.

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And, yeah, eventually, when I have a bit more kind of childcare support and resources, I

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will definitely want to be getting some kind of herbal packs out to people like Tina, you

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know, who are supporting people they love in prison.

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So, yeah, if that's you, please bear me in mind and get in touch if I can kind of support

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you in the future.

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Okay, take care.

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Links thanks so much for listening to the Frontline Herbalism podcast.

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You can find the transcript, the links, all the resources from the

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show@solidarityapothecary.org.

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podcast.